[osis-core] proposal: <cite> for OT Quote in NT

[Patrick Durusau]

Troy,

I was just checking on the types for quotation and found that we have 
enumerated "block" for its type. Hmmm, bad joss! Any strong feelings on 
that?

The reason I ask is that there appears to be a feeling that quotations 
are always accurate or correct. Whether intentional or not, I suspect a 
large number of quotations in early Church history bear little 
resemblance to what we would consider modern quotation practice.

If I am going to quote you or Chris or Steve, you expect me to quote 
exactly what you said and hopefully with some context.

That perception of literal quoting is a largely modern view. The early 
use of the KJV for example, was as a prompt and although someone might 
say they were quoting the KJV, they were not all that particular about 
using its exact words but used it to inform their own translation from 
the original languages. Apparently (as I only have reports of this 
behavior) they did not consider it odd or amiss to "quote" the KJV in 
this manner. Is it still a quote? Hmmm, I would say so but it is not a 
quote in the sense that I would quote someone on this list.

Perhaps the better action would be to either add an attribute to quote 
or redo type to allow you to specify, if desired, some continum for the 
type of quote you have in mind. Is it literal? (in the modern sense), a 
Church Father's quote (probably a paraphrase), etc.

Suggestions? Comments?

Hope you are having a great day!

Patrick




Troy A. Griffitts wrote:
> Kirk, Thanks for the examples of other occurrences where we might use an 
> element that means to cite without claiming the exactly wording of the 
> original author.
> 
> Everyone,
> 
>     I would like to suggest that we add, e.g. <cite 
> osisRef="abednahr">text of the citation</cite>
> 
>     This new element would designate to a segment of text: allusion to 
> or excerpt from, and assign credit to, a source, WITHOUT the libel 
> implications of, and asserting the author is claiming, a direct quotation.
> 
> Other support for this need:
> 
>     When writing a research paper, many sources are cited (traditionally 
> designated with superscripts and endnotes).  Of these citations, there 
> are usually 2 distinct types: a) ones where the author quotes the source 
> directly, which he will use QUOTE (") to designate; b) ones the author 
> merely paraphrases and appeals to for authority.
> 
>     Also, note that I have not claimed <q> and <cite> to be mutually 
> exclusive for a segment of text.  I can imagine something like this:
> 
> Todd claims, <cite osisRef="ToddT">SIL is bringing together a USFM 
> sample document that <q>represents complete usage</q> of the 
> specification.</cite>
>     
> 
>     I realize that I am proposing a change while holding a minority 
> share in the pool of people who have expressed preference, to this 
> point.  So, discussion and comments are very much welcome.
> 
>     -Troy.
> 
> 
> 
> Kirk Lowery wrote:
> 
>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
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>>
>> Can I muddy the waters a bit further? :-)
>>
>> In the NT there have been identifications of Pauline allusions to and
>> even direct citation of Greek authors. And then there's the whole
>> business of Jude and the Assumption of Moses. Finally, in the OT we have
>> the direct extended citation of "`Abed-nahar" or "Transpotamian"
>> documents (the Persian Empire's name for their Palestinian province) in
>> the Aramaic language in Ezra. These documents are embedded in a larger
>> narrative and so it is critical that markup can distinguish them, even
>> in translation. And how about when the prophets or Psalms quote the
>> Torah, especially the Exodus account?
>>
>> What do we do about these? Is there at present a generic mechanism
>> whereby I can arbitrarily identify the source of quotations?
>>
>> Blessings,
>>
>> Kirk
>> - --
>> Kirk E. Lowery, Ph.D.
>> Director, Westminster Hebrew Institute
>> Adjunct Professor of Old Testament
>> Westminster Theological Seminary, Philadelphia
>>
>> Theorie ist, wenn man alles weiss und nichts klappt.
>> Praxis ist, wenn alles klappt und keiner weiss warum.
>> Bei uns sind Theorie und Praxis vereint:
>> nichts klappt und keiner weiss warum!
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> 
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-- 
Patrick Durusau
Director of Research and Development
Society of Biblical Literature
Patrick.Durusau@sbl-site.org
Chair, V1 - Text Processing: Office and Publishing Systems Interface
Co-Editor, ISO 13250, Topic Maps -- Reference Model

Topic Maps: Human, not artificial, intelligence at work!