[osis-core] Paragraph/verse containers

[Troy A. Griffitts]

Patrick,
	Thanks for your comment from France!  You should be out enjoying the 
surrounding!

	I think the real focus is NOT contemporary translation methods.  I just 
finished encoding the NASB and used verse containers.


	THE REAL DIFFERENCE IMO is the _USE_ of the encoded document.  I WILL 
ALWAYS use verse containers internally in my software and BREAK 
PARAGRAPHS, as it stands right now.

	The reasons:

	1) Todd is focused on rendering entire Bibles.
	2) I am focused on letting a user interact Scripture.

In my world users give me verse containers like John.1.1 or 
John.1.1-John.1.9.  I have to go retrieve these containers.  Everything 
is centered around these containers.

Now, as Steve and others have pointed out, there are VERY VALUABLE 
applications of paragraph CONTAINERS for DIGITAL textual content 
analysis, but most of my users do ANALOG textual content analysis :)
Nonetheless.  I hope to add more 'paragraph' centric search abilities 
and the like.  But 99% of my processing is done on verse containers, and 
even if that changes to 90% in the future, I will still remain verse 
container-centric.


Just to sum up my perfect world: I would love for all Bibles to mark 
paragraph containers.  Even if they did, I would still choose to use 
verse containers and use milestones to mark paragraphs.

	-Troy.



Patrick Durusau wrote:
> Chris,
> 
> Todd can answer for himself but from my conversations with him I suspect 
> that he thinks that the KJV is an anomaly in terms of modern translation 
>  practices which tends to favor structures that cross verse boundaries.
> 
> Whatever the merits of modern translation practice, there are a lot of 
> historical texts that do not follow that practice.
> 
> Since I was using his text as a sample, I was simply following what he 
> had entered. We now have a couple of more weeks on the users manual and 
> I will have time to "cook" the examples to be more focused than looked 
> like I would have time to do with the original schedule.
> 
> Should have copious notes that direct a user to more advanced treatment 
> of some issues, like verse boundaries. I really dislike works that force 
> the reader to hunt for material relevant to their problems. Perhaps, not 
> in the first beta release, we need to have indexes something like: Guide 
> for Encoding Modern Translations, Guide to Encoding Classic Translation 
> and the like, being pointers to the relevant materials on each one, 
> perhaps not in the same order as presented in the manual.
> 
> Thoughts?
> 
> Hope you are having a great day!
> 
> Patrick
> 
> Chris Little wrote:
> 
>> Todd,
>>
>> It sounds like you're advocating using milestones everywhere all of 
>> the time, at least for <verse>.  If that were our desire, why would we 
>> have included <verse> as a container at all?
>>
>> The KJV is every bit as complex as any other Bible in terms of its 
>> needing milestones to mark structures such as quotations, which will 
>> cross verse boundaries.  But the real issue here is to make the 
>> example as simple as humanly possible.  To that end, I think it should 
>> be limited to containers.  From that point, the manual can build more 
>> complicated structures and detail to the user why to use milestones 
>> instead of containers in certain circumstances, etc.
>>
>> --Chris
>>
>> Todd Tillinghast wrote:
>>
>>> Chris and Patrick,
>>>
>>> I think we would be doing a disservice to the newbies if we were to take
>>> out the milestones.  Better to start them off right and not have to
>>> relearn later.  Most real Bible's other than the KJV will require the
>>> use of milestones?
>>>
>>> Let's show them a real but simple example.
>>>
>>> Todd
>>>
>>>  
>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: osis-core-admin@bibletechnologieswg.org [mailto:osis-core-
>>>> admin@bibletechnologieswg.org] On Behalf Of Chris Little
>>>> Sent: Sunday, November 02, 2003 12:17 PM
>>>> To: osis-core@bibletechnologieswg.org
>>>> Subject: Re: [osis-core] Esth. corrected
>>>>
>>>> Patrick,
>>>>
>>>> Why not just use container markup for the <verse>'s instead of the
>>>> milestones (to avoid scaring the newbies).  I'd also recommend
>>>>   
>>>
>>>
>>> stripping
>>>  
>>>
>>>> out anything that uses the attribute extension mechanism
>>>>   
>>>
>>>
>>> (x-copyright).
>>>  
>>>
>>>> If we're giving it in our "minimal" example, it implies we omitted
>>>> something very basic.
>>>>
>>>> --Chris
>>>>
>>>> Patrick Durusau wrote:
>>>>   
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
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> 
>