[bt-devel] close button on bookshelf dialog

Mon Jun 27 00:19:59 MST 2011

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Hi Martin,

In what way is it sensible to duplicate this functionality and waste a
lot of screen space? I completely disagree. Please explain why having
two close buttons is sensible usability design?

I'm willing to compromise, if the close button remains on the same
bottom row with the page-specific buttons, we remove the "Installation
source" and "Install folder:" elements and the "Start installation:"
label from the install page and the "Start removal:" label from the
remove page. Note that this breaks the user guidance scheme we have in
place on the install and remove dialogs, but has no unreasonable waste
of space and users attention is not overly divided between too many GUI
elements. Similar ideas are welcome.

I will not allow the close button just to be added on a new row, because
it is not sensible usability design.

Blessings!
Jaak

PS: I've passed a user interface design course (4 ECTS).
PPS: Afaik Gnome 3 is the only thing thats buggy. Correct me if I'm wrong.

On 27.06.2011 09:29, Martin Gruner wrote:
> Hi Jaak,
> 
> I didn't notice the button removal back then, sorry. So I might be too
> late, but it doesn't change the matter of fact that having a close
> button is sensible usability design for PC software. I don't see a
> benefit of conditional compliation.
> 
> Regards,
> mg
> 
> Am 26.06.11 21:38, schrieb Jaak Ristioja:
>> Dear Gary and Martin,
>>
>> I reverted Gary's addition of the close button to the Bookshelf manager
>> also because it was actually more-or-less a revert of my removal of the
>> close button back in September (commit c277ce) even before 2.8 beta, so
>> this has always been in the stable-2.8 branch. I even documented this
>> feature in the ChangeLog and announced the bookshelf manager redesign in
>> the 2.8 beta release announcement. You and Martin released Windows and
>> MacOS binaries of 2.8 beta. I might have bad memory, but I really don't
>> remember anybody objecting to my GUI redesign back then. So I've been
>> very happy about the redesign ever since. And I still am.
>>
>> I'm very sorry, but you're just too late trying to take this up now.
>> Where were you when the discussion should have taken place? :|
>>
>> On 24.06.2011 17:09, Gary Holmlund wrote:
>>> I believe a close button
>>> belongs on this dialog for usability reasons alone, even if a close icon
>>> is in the upper right corner.
>>
>> I disagree. We should strive for simplicity and not duplicate such GUI
>> functionality (the KISS principle). Such waste of screen space harms
>> usability, especially on small screens (e.g Meego devices?).
>>
>>>> Also, Meego does not put any window icons on their dialogs. There is
>>>> no work around for closing it on Meego.
>>
>> According to
>> https://meego.com/developers/ui-design-guidelines/handset/designing-your-application
>> Meego appears to have a "close" button. Please tell me if I
>> misunderstood that text and those figures.
>>
>> The current Bookshelf Manager GUI works well on Windows, KDE and Gnome
>> 2. Gnome 3 has a bug which prevents it from working, so this is not an
>> issue we must work around in BibleTime. Has anybody even run it on
>> Meego? Any other platforms with problems?
>>
>> This is not a bug. This is a feature introduced more than 9 months ago.
>> IF and only IF there is a serious reason to re-introduce the close
>> button, it should be done using conditional compilation (e.g.
>> #ifdef/#ifndef). The default should be to compile without the close
>> button.
>>
>>
>> God bless!
>> Jaak
>>
>>
>> PS: In the future we should probably also discuss about simplifying the
>> MDI stuff and everything related to the subwindow toolbars.
> 
> _______________________________________________
> bt-devel mailing list
> bt-devel at crosswire.org
> http://www.crosswire.org/mailman/listinfo/bt-devel
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> bt-devel mailing list
> bt-devel at crosswire.org
> http://www.crosswire.org/mailman/listinfo/bt-devel

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v2.0.17 (GNU/Linux)
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=Ky01
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----