[xiphos-devel] that blasted editor

Greg Hellings greg.hellings at gmail.com
Sat Apr 18 13:14:03 MST 2020

On Sat, Apr 18, 2020, 08:32 Karl Kleinpaste <karl at kleinpaste.org> wrote:

> Just to be clear... You folks are in fact suggesting excising the current
> integrated editor, to replace it with another integrated editor, just one
> that speaks a different editing scheme. You're walking the center line,
> between fixing the current nightmare-to-upgrade editor vs. removing it in
> favor of reduction to linkage to an entirely external editor.

Yes. I think editing in the app is the best approach and best UX for people.

> That's fine. I mean, I suppose I can roll either way, I guess. I just
> thought folks would be happier with reducing Xiphos' involvement with
> editing from "we do everything in editing" to mere external linkage at
> start ("here's the initial [usually empty] doc") and end ("let me now
> inhale the result of your editing").

I think, for the casual user, this would feel strange. We power users and
developers are accustomed to that workflow. But most people aren't.

> For the record, I would have never suggested literally using $EDITOR. Joe
> Random doesn't want to do styled editing in an ordinary text editor, as is
> usually indicated by $EDITOR.
> On 4/18/20 5:53 AM, Greg Hellings wrote:
> * Links are pretty trivial
> Bear in mind that links in such docs are not just external http-style
> links to external sites. The important aspect is cross-referential links,
> that is, internal links to other Sword modules. See
> http://karl.kleinpaste.org/xiphos/ and look at link-genbook*, especially
> -3. (Once upon a time, those images were a brief tutorial on how to do a
> link in Xiphos.) These create links like these:
> 1. Direct linkage to any other Sword module:
> <A
> HREF="sword://Josephus/%2FThe+Antiquities+of+the+Jews%2FBook+18%2FChapter+3%2FSection+3">jos.18.3.3</A>

In MarkDown this becomes:


Very easy for us to programmatically walk people through.

> 2. Scripture xref through the verse list:
> <A
> HREF="passagestudy.jsp?action=showRef&amp;type=scripRef&amp;module=&amp;value=Genesis+2%3A24">Genesis
> 2:24</A>

Same here. This becomes:


> This takes advantage of the HTML nature in ThML's essence as
> HTML-plus-goodies. ("Goodies" are <note>, <sync>, and <scripRef>.) The
> latter example exploits internal habit of how the engine's filters generate
> xref from scripRef; the former is simply an odd protocol, "sword://". No,
> these are not concepts that are portable to other Sword apps.  Er, well,
> sword:// is known in some corners other than Xiphos, and xiphos-nav
> operates on its basis.
> I wish I could have done xrefs as actual ThML <scripRef>, avoiding the
> post-filter appearance of such links, but that wasn't possible.

It's not likely to be possible here, either. HOWEVER, someone can enter
them directly as scripRef if we support md, and they'll be inserted to the
module that way. When they come back out, they can either stay as ThML or
we can render them to HTML and from there into MD.

Nothing says we would have to parse the result into HTML first, though.
That's part of the beauty of markdown. We can edit however we want, and let
users use a combo if they desire.

> And no, these features aren't reflective of my personal bias re: ThML.
> It's just that an editor's HTML result is best interpreted by Sword as
> ThML, exactly because of HTML-plus-goodies. HTML content makes no sense as
> any other Sword-grasped content type. If we could add an MD filter set to
> Sword directly, we could walk away from round trip MD to HTML and HTML to
> MD. But that's not going to happen.

We can skip the HTML entirely and leave the user editing the ThML->markdown
as is. Then things like the rendered out links aren't an issue.

And adding a MarkDown filter to the engine probably isn't very difficult at
all. MD is very simple.


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