<div style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;">I'm forwarding this to the wider community, in order to obtain a response regarding my suggestion that we design a new SWORD filter to process <b>abbreviations</b>.<br><br>See my last reply to the modules team for details.</div><div style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;"><br></div>
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Best regards,<br><br>David
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------- Forwarded Message -------<br>
From: David Haslam <dfhdfh@protonmail.com><br>
Date: On Sunday, May 11th, 2025 at 4:45 PM<br>
Subject: Re: [modules] New Beta Module: Tyndale<br>
To: domcox@crosswire.org <domcox@crosswire.org>, Fr Cyrille <fr.cyrille@tiberiade.be><br>
CC: modules@crosswire.org <modules@crosswire.org><br><br>
<blockquote type="cite" class="protonmail_quote">
<div style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;">Dear all,<br><br>Today, I have begun to examine the use of <b>Roman numerals</b> to translate numbers in the <b>Tyndale</b> module text exported using <b>diatheke</b>.<br><br>The following records match a simple <b>PCRE</b> that simply looks for words that consist entirely of the permitted lowercase letters found in numbers using Roman numerals.<br><br>Here's my PCRE: <span style="font-family: Menlo, Consolas, "Courier New", monospace;"><b>[ijvxlcdm]+</b></span><br><br>The search was performed on the <b>word frequency</b> analysis already done using <b>BabelPad</b> Tools.<br><br><blockquote style="border-left: 3px solid rgb(200, 200, 200); border-top-color: rgb(200, 200, 200); border-right-color: rgb(200, 200, 200); border-bottom-color: rgb(200, 200, 200); padding-left: 10px; color: rgb(102, 102, 102);"><div><span>1 cxliiii</span><div><span>38 did</span></div><div><span>15 i</span></div><div><span>16 ii</span></div><div><span>1 iic</span></div><div><span>22 iii</span></div><div><span>31 iiii</span></div><div><span>1 iiiii</span></div><div><span>68 iiij</span></div><div><span>81 iij</span></div><div><span>137 ij</span></div><div><span>16 ix</span></div><div><span>25 l</span></div><div><span>1 li</span></div><div><span>1 liii</span></div><div><span>2 liiij</span></div><div><span>3 liij</span></div><div><span>1 lij</span></div><div><span>2 lix</span></div><div><span>3 lvij</span></div><div><span>10 lx</span></div><div><span>2 lxi</span></div><div><span>2 lxiiij</span></div><div><span>4 lxij</span></div><div><span>1 lxix</span></div><div><span>4 lxv</span></div><div><span>1 lxvj</span></div><div><span>25 lxx</span></div><div><span>2 lxxiiij</span></div><div><span>2 lxxiij</span></div><div><span>2 lxxij</span></div><div><span>6 lxxv</span></div><div><span>1 lxxvi</span></div><div><span>1 lxxvij</span></div><div><span>3 lxxx</span></div><div><span>1 lxxxiij</span></div><div><span>2 lxxxij</span></div><div><span>2 lxxxvi</span></div><div><span>1 lxxxvij</span></div><div><span>1 lxxxx</span></div><div><span>1 m</span></div><div><span>7 mi</span></div><div><span>1 mid</span></div><div><span>86 v</span></div><div><span>26 vi</span></div><div><span>43 vii</span></div><div><span>5 viii</span></div><div><span>26 viij</span></div><div><span>133 vij</span></div><div><span>5 vj</span></div><div><span>51 x</span></div><div><span>9 xi</span></div><div><span>45 xii</span></div><div><span>1 xiiii</span></div><div><span>20 xiiij</span></div><div><span>4 xiij</span></div><div><span>31 xij</span></div><div><span>1 xix</span></div><div><span>1 xj</span></div><div><span>59 xl</span></div><div><span>2 xli</span></div><div><span>2 xlii</span></div><div><span>3 xliiii</span></div><div><span>1 xliij</span></div><div><span>1 xlij</span></div><div><span>1 xlix</span></div><div><span>4 xlv</span></div><div><span>3 xlvi</span></div><div><span>1 xlviij</span></div><div><span>1 xlvij</span></div><div><span>18 xv</span></div><div><span>6 xvi</span></div><div><span>3 xviii</span></div><div><span>1 xviij</span></div><div><span>4 xvij</span></div><div><span>53 xx</span></div><div><span>1 xxiii</span></div><div><span>7 xxiiii</span></div><div><span>2 xxiiij</span></div><div><span>1 xxiij</span></div><div><span>3 xxij</span></div><div><span>2 xxix</span></div><div><span>1 xxj</span></div><div><span>2 xxv</span></div><div><span>2 xxviij</span></div><div><span>2 xxvij</span></div><div><span>51 xxx</span></div><div><span>1 xxxiiij</span></div><div><span>3 xxxiij</span></div><div><span>6 xxxij</span></div><div><span>3 xxxv</span></div><div><span>2 xxxvi</span></div><div><span>1 xxxviii</span></div><div><span>1 xxxviij</span></div><div><span>5 xxxvij</span></div></div></blockquote></div><div style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;"><br></div>
<div class="protonmail_signature_block" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;">
<div class="protonmail_signature_block-user"><b><u>Observations:</u></b></div><div class="protonmail_signature_block-user"><br></div><div class="protonmail_signature_block-user"><ol data-editing-info="{"orderedStyleType":1,"unorderedStyleType":1}" style="margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px;" data-listchain="__List_Chain_423"><li style="list-style-type: "1. ";">Most of the numbers in verse text that potentially match Roman numerals are lowercase.</li><li style="list-style-type: "2. ";"><span style="scrollbar-width:thin;scrollbar-color:rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.35) rgba(0, 0, 0, 0)"><span style="scrollbar-width:thin;scrollbar-color:rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.35) rgba(0, 0, 0, 0)">There are 103 unique strings that potentially match<span> </span>Roman numerals irrespective of case.</span></span><br></li><li style="list-style-type: "3. ";"><span><span style="scrollbar-width:thin;scrollbar-color:rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.35) rgba(0, 0, 0, 0)">There are 95 unique strings that potentially match <span style="display: inline !important; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">lowercase </span>Roman numerals.</span><br></span></li><li style="list-style-type: "4. ";">A few of these can be discounted as being ordinary words: "did", "mi", "mid", etc.</li><li style="list-style-type: "5. ";">Arabic numeral 4 is often represented as either "iiii" or "iiij" instead of "iv" reflecting the usage of that period.</li><li style="list-style-type: "6. ";">The use of the alternative final letter "j" in place of "i" is likely to be a printer's flourish of that period.</li><li style="list-style-type: "7. "; color: rgb(102, 102, 102);">The vast majority of such strings found in verse text are marked with a period (full stop) fore 'n' aft. e.g. ".<span style="text-align: start; display: inline !important; color: rgb(102, 102, 102); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">xxx."</span></li><li style="list-style-type: "8. "; color: rgb(102, 102, 102);"><span style="text-align: start; display: inline !important; color: rgb(102, 102, 102); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">Some strings omit one or both of these <b>period delimiters!</b></span></li><li style="list-style-type: "9. "; color: rgb(102, 102, 102);"><span style="text-align: start; display: inline !important; color: rgb(102, 102, 102); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">Some strings are wrongly preceded by ". " rather than " ." (misplaced delimiter due to <span style="display: inline !important; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">OCR error ?</span>)<br></span></li><li style="list-style-type: "10. "; color: rgb(102, 102, 102);"><span style="text-align: start; display: inline !important; color: rgb(102, 102, 102); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">The total number of matches to PCRE "<span style="font-family: Menlo, Consolas, "Courier New", monospace;"><b>\W[ijvxlcdm]+\W</b></span><span>" (without the quotes) is <b>1293</b></span></span></li><li style="list-style-type: "11. "; color: rgb(102, 102, 102);"><span style="text-align: start; display: inline !important; color: rgb(102, 102, 102); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"><span><span style="scrollbar-width: thin; scrollbar-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.35) rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); display: inline !important; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"><span style="scrollbar-width:thin;scrollbar-color:rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.35) rgba(0, 0, 0, 0)"><span style="scrollbar-width:thin;scrollbar-color:rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.35) rgba(0, 0, 0, 0)">Of<span> </span><span style="scrollbar-width: thin; scrollbar-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.35) rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); display: inline !important; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">those 1293</span>, only <b>958</b> <span style="scrollbar-width: thin; scrollbar-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.35) rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); display: inline !important; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">match the PCRE "</span><span style="scrollbar-width: thin; scrollbar-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.35) rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); font-family: Menlo, Consolas, "Courier New", monospace; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"><b style="scrollbar-width:thin;scrollbar-color:rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.35) rgba(0, 0, 0, 0)">\.[ijvxlcdm]+\.</b></span><span style="scrollbar-width: thin; scrollbar-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.35) rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">" (i.e. with both the proper<span> </span><b style="scrollbar-width:thin;scrollbar-color:rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.35) rgba(0, 0, 0, 0)">period</b><span> </span>delimiters).</span></span></span></span><br></span></span></li><li style="list-style-type: "12. "; color: rgb(102, 102, 102);"><span style="text-align: start; display: inline !important; color: rgb(102, 102, 102); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"><span><span>That leaves <b>335</b> instances in which there's a missing or misplaced <b>period</b> delimiter (or which are ordinary words).</span></span></span></li><li style="list-style-type: "13. "; color: rgb(102, 102, 102);">Searching for patterns that include uppercase Roman numerals is more difficult because of the very common word "I" (first person pronoun).<span style="text-align: start; display: inline !important; color: rgb(102, 102, 102); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"><span><span></span></span></span></li><li style="list-style-type: "14. "; color: rgb(102, 102, 102);">The total number of matches to PCRE "<span style="font-family: Menlo, Consolas, "Courier New", monospace;"><b>\W[ijvxlcdmJVXLCDM]+\W</b></span><span>" <span style="text-align: start; display: inline !important; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">(without the quotes) is<span> 1314.</span></span></span></li><li style="list-style-type: "15. "; color: rgb(102, 102, 102);"><span><span style="text-align: start; display: inline !important; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"><span>That means we thereby discovered 21 further potential candidates in which at least one letter is uppercase, excluding "I",</span></span></span></li></ol></div><div class="protonmail_signature_block-user"><br></div><div class="protonmail_signature_block-user">If the <b>Tyndale Bible</b> was printed consistently with every number properly delimited between two periods, and always lowercase,<br>then it has become apparent that there are many instances where the digitised text did not faithfully transcribe many of these!<br><br>We therefore require the upstream source to be thoroughly checked in this regard, and edited to fix all such OCR errors.<br><br>Looking to the future, we might also make good use of the OSIS element <b>abbr</b> to encode all such numbers. E.g.</div><div class="protonmail_signature_block-user"><br></div><div class="protonmail_signature_block-user"><span style="font-family: Menlo, Consolas, "Courier New", monospace; font-size: 13.5pt; line-height: normal; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"><abbr type="x-Roman" expansion="30">.xxx.</abbr></span><br><br><u>Aside</u>: It would be a cool enhancement to the SWORD API to provide support for a new filter:</div><div class="protonmail_signature_block-user"><br></div><div class="protonmail_signature_block-user"><span style="font-size: 13.5pt; line-height: normal; font-family: Menlo, Consolas, "Courier New", monospace;">GlobalOptionFilter=OSISExpandAbbreviations</span><br><br>cf. Does the <b>SWORD API</b> <span style="display: inline !important; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">already </span>provide any support for the <b>abbr</b> element? If so, what is the functionality ?</div><div class="protonmail_signature_block-user"><br>Best regards,<br><br>David
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On Sunday, May 11th, 2025 at 3:35 PM, David Haslam <dfhdfh@protonmail.com> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="protonmail_quote" type="cite">
<div style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;"><span>Dear Cyrille, dear Dom,<br><br>In numerous places, the digital text of the Tyndale module omits the <b>macron</b> over a vowel that's there in the original printed pages. e.g. <b>Abraha</b> - should be <b>Abrahā</b>.</span><br></div><div style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;"><br>This is just one example of the many kinds of deficiencies in the upstream source.</div><div style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;"><br></div><div style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;"><span style="display: inline !important; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">Fixing these in the upstream source would require a lot of intensive effort.</span><br><br></div>
<div style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;" class="protonmail_signature_block">
<div class="protonmail_signature_block-user">
Best regards,<br><br>David
</div>
<div style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;"><br></div>
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On Wednesday, May 7th, 2025 at 7:29 PM, David Haslam <dfhdfh@protonmail.com> wrote:<br>
<blockquote type="cite" class="protonmail_quote">
<div style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;">Hi Cyrille,<br><br>Unless users know what the MALTESE CROSS & the CROSS PATTY WITH RIGHT CROSSBAR actually denote, how does including them help the Bible student?<br><br></div><div style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;"><ul data-editing-info="{"orderedStyleType":1,"unorderedStyleType":1}" style="margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px;"><li style="list-style-type: disc;"><span>Can we try to we find out more?<br></span></li><li style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px; list-style-type: disc;">Would ChatGPT help in any way?</li></ul></div><div style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;"><br></div>
<div class="protonmail_signature_block" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;">
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Best regards,<br><br>David
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On Wednesday, May 7th, 2025 at 6:30 PM, Fr Cyrille <fr.cyrille@tiberiade.be> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="protonmail_quote" type="cite">
<br>
<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">Le 07/05/2025 à 15:08, David Haslam a
écrit :<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;">
<p>Hi Cyrille,</p>
<p>Why was <u>only one</u> correction made?<br>
<br>
I listed <u>two locations</u> where the verse hadn't been
properly referenced!</p>
<ul style="margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px;" data-editing-info="{"orderedStyleType":1,"unorderedStyleType":1}">
<li style="list-style-type: disc;"><span>
You have fixed <b>Acts 9:38</b>:<br>
</span></li>
<li style="list-style-type: disc;">
<p>
You have <u>not</u> fixed <b>Revelation of John 1:9</b>:</p>
</li>
</ul>
</div>
</blockquote>
I did, but i missed osisID....<br>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;">
<div style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;" class="protonmail_signature_block">
<div class="protonmail_signature_block-user">And those tow
types of peculiar symbol are all still there!</div>
<div class="protonmail_signature_block-user">
<div>
<ul style="margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px;" data-editing-info="{"orderedStyleType":1,"unorderedStyleType":1}">
<li style="list-style-type: disc;"><span>3 of U+2720 ✠
MALTESE CROSS</span></li>
<li style="list-style-type: disc;"><span>5 of U+2E50 ⹐
CROSS PATTY WITH RIGHT CROSSBAR<br>
</span></li>
</ul>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
Ok you want it to be removed?<br>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;">
<div style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;" class="protonmail_signature_block">
<div class="protonmail_signature_block-user"><br>
</div>
<div class="protonmail_signature_block-user"><br>
Best regards,<br>
<br>
David </div>
<div style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;"><br>
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On Wednesday, May 7th, 2025 at 1:50 PM, <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:domcox@crosswire.org" rel="noreferrer nofollow noopener">domcox@crosswire.org</a> <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:domcox@crosswire.org" rel="noreferrer nofollow noopener">domcox@crosswire.org</a> wrote:
<blockquote>
<p>This is to announce that we have just now uploaded Tyndale<br>
in the CrossWire beta repository for testing purposes.</p>
<p>If no raised concern nor a quality alert has been sent on
the list,<br>
Tyndale will be published in a week.</p>
<p>This is an update.<br>
Language=English<br>
Version=2.0<br>
History_2.0=(2025-05-07) New source<br>
TextSource=<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Bible_(Tyndale)" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer nofollow noopener">https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Bible_(Tyndale)</a><br>
Versification=KJV</p>
<p>Many thanks to everyone who contributed to this release.</p>
<p>yours</p>
<p>P.S.: This email is sent automatically.</p>
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</blockquote>
</div>
</blockquote>
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</blockquote><br>
</div>
</blockquote><br>
</div>
</blockquote><br>
</div>
</blockquote><br>
</div>