<html><body><div dir="ltr">I would not expect any Bible translator to do anything.</div><div dir="ltr"><br></div><div dir="ltr">if they tell us they used whatever to mark up whatever then it is our job as module team tk take whatever and find the appropriate semantic mark up and apply it. </div><div dir="ltr"><br></div><div dir="ltr">This is not different. </div><div dir="ltr"><br></div><div dir="ltr">Peter</div><div id="ms-outlook-mobile-body-separator-line" dir="ltr"><br></div><div id="ms-outlook-mobile-signature">Sent from <a href="https://aka.ms/o0ukef">Outlook for iOS</a></div><div id="mail-editor-reference-message-container" class="ms-outlook-mobile-reference-message"><hr style="display: inline-block; width: 98%;"><div id="divRplyFwdMsg" dir="ltr"><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><b>From:</b> sword-devel <sword-devel-bounces@crosswire.org> on behalf of David Haslam <dfhdfh@protonmail.com><br><b>Sent:</b> Thursday, May 1, 2025 12:59 pm<br><b>To:</b> SWORD Developers' Collaboration Forum <sword-devel@crosswire.org><br><b>Cc:</b> David Haslam <df.haslam@btinternet.com><br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [sword-devel] Proposal for a new SWORD filter to display word dividers</span><div style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"> </div></div><div style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;">Hi Peter,</div><div dir="ltr" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;"><br></div><div style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;">Undoubtedly, but we cannot demand or expect most Bible translators to be XML afficionados.</div><div dir="ltr" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;"><br></div><div style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;">It's even difficult to teach some members of a translation team to use the ZWSP properly.<br><br>"If you cannot see it, key it again" can so easily become the <i>modus operandi</i>.</div><div style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;">Witness the following in the same chapter prior to my involvement.</div><div style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;">After I replaced all ZWSP by MIDDLE DOT, just look at the tangle!!!<br><i>See attached text file</i>.<br><br>So we should do "belt and braces" to help the weak. </div><div style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;">Also called "going the extra mile". ๐</div><div dir="ltr" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;"><br></div><div class="protonmail_signature_block-user" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;">But worry not. My feedback is already helping the Khmer translation team. </div><div dir="ltr" class="protonmail_signature_block-user" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;"><br></div><div class="protonmail_signature_block-user" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;">
Best regards,<br><br>David
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Sent with <a href="https://pr.tn/ref/SWXT9A5YZ67G">Proton Mail</a> secure email.
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On Thursday, May 1st, 2025 at 12:47 PM, Peter von Kaehne <refdoc@gmx.net> wrote:<br>
</div><blockquote><div dir="ltr" class="protonmail_quote">I think this is not difficult per se, but it should be properly encoded. </div><div dir="ltr" class="protonmail_quote"><br></div><div dir="ltr" class="protonmail_quote"><w> seems correct, using zero with characters seems not correct. </div><div dir="ltr" class="protonmail_quote"><br></div><div dir="ltr" class="protonmail_quote">Peter</div><div dir="ltr" id="ms-outlook-mobile-body-separator-line"><br></div><div id="ms-outlook-mobile-signature">Sent from <a href="https://aka.ms/o0ukef" rel="noreferrer nofollow noopener">Outlook for iOS</a></div><div class="ms-outlook-mobile-reference-message" id="mail-editor-reference-message-container"><hr style="display: inline-block; width: 98%;"><div dir="ltr" id="divRplyFwdMsg"><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><b>From:</b> sword-devel <sword-devel-bounces@crosswire.org> on behalf of David Haslam <dfhdfh@protonmail.com><br><b>Sent:</b> Thursday, May 1, 2025 11:30 am<br><b>To:</b> sword-devel mailing list <sword-devel@crosswire.org><br><b>Cc:</b> David Haslam <df.haslam@btinternet.com><br><b>Subject:</b> [sword-devel] Proposal for a new SWORD filter to display word dividers</span><div style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"> </div></div><div style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;">I wish to propose that we design in a new SWORD filter.<br><br>The conf key would be:</div><ul style="margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px;"><li style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px; list-style-type: disc;"><b>GlobalOptionFilter=ShowWordDividers</b></li></ul><div dir="ltr" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;"><br></div><div style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;">In the writing systems for the various languages of SE Asia (<b>Thai</b>, <b>Khmer</b>, <b>Lao</b>, <b>Myanmar</b>) there is [generally] <b>no space between words</b>.</div><div dir="ltr" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;"><br></div><div style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;">In this respect, they are like many European languages before the start of <a href="https://www.amazon.com/Space-Between-Words-Origins-Medieval/dp/080474016X" title="silent reading" rel="noreferrer nofollow noopener">silent reading</a>. The descriptive term is <b><i>Scriptura Continua</i></b>.</div><div style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;"><br>Some Bible translations for this region are already making use of one of the ZERO WIDTH characters to invisibly mark the divisions between lexical words.</div><div style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;">Options include:</div><ul style="margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px;"><li style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px; list-style-type: disc;">U+200B ZERO WIDTH SPACE</li><li style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px; list-style-type: disc;">U+200C ZERO WIDTH NON-JOINER</li><li style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px; list-style-type: disc;">U+FEFF ZERO WIDTH NO BREAK SPACE</li></ul><div style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;">They exclude:</div><ul style="margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px;"><li style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px; list-style-type: disc;">U+200D ZERO WIDTH JOINER</li></ul><div style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;">A further possibility, even without requiring a full study Bible with Strong's, etc, is to simply wrap each lexical word within the OSIS <b>w</b> element.</div><div style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;">One without any OSIS attributes would suffice for this purpose. Likewise, for the <b>seg</b> element.</div><div dir="ltr" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;"><br></div><div style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;">My proposal is that we design a feature to <b>show/hide word dividers</b> by displaying them using a suitable visible but non-intrusive character.</div><div style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;">My suggestion is to use this Unicode character by default:</div><div dir="ltr" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;"><br></div><ul style="margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px;"><li style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px; list-style-type: disc;">U+00B7 MIDDLE DOT</li></ul><div dir="ltr" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;"><br></div><div class="protonmail_signature_block-user" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;">We could even allow the actual visible character to be specified in a second conf key, thus:</div><div dir="ltr" class="protonmail_signature_block-user" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;"><br></div><ul style="margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px;"><li style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px; list-style-type: disc;">VisibleWordDivider=U+00B7</li></ul><div dir="ltr" class="protonmail_signature_block-user" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;"><br></div><div class="protonmail_signature_block-user" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;">Benefits would include:</div><ul style="margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px;"><li style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;">Helps with language learning to know where lexical words start and end</li><li style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;">Helps with front-end search for whole words, exact phrase or all words</li><li style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;">Helps with checking the accuracy of Bible translations by clearly displaying lexical word boundaries at the touch of a single key in the front-end</li><li style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;">Paves the way for Study Bible with the addition of Strong's mark-up, etc.</li></ul><div dir="ltr" class="protonmail_signature_block-user" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;"><br></div><div class="protonmail_signature_block-user" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;">Here's a sample of Khmer verse text with the MIDDLE DOT as the visible word divider:</div><blockquote style="padding-left: 10px; border-left-width: 3px; border-left-style: solid; border-left-color: rgb(200, 200, 200);"><div class="protonmail_signature_block-user" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px; color: rgb(102, 102, 102);"><b>Obad.1.1</b> </div><table class="protonmail_signature_block-user" style="width: 561pt; box-sizing: border-box; border-collapse: collapse; border-spacing: 0px;"><tbody><tr><td class="protonmail_signature_block-user" align="left" style="width: 561pt; height: 29.25pt; border-width: 0.5pt medium 0.5pt 0.5pt; border-style: solid none solid solid; border-color: white currentcolor white white; background-color: rgb(184, 204, 228); padding-top: 1px; padding-right: 1px; padding-left: 1px; vertical-align: top; color: black;"><div class="protonmail_signature_block-user" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-size: 11pt;">แแแยทแแถยทแแปแแทแยทแแทแแทแแแยทแแแแยทแแแยทแขแผแแถแแถ
แแแแแขแแแ
แถแแยทแแถยทแแแแยทแแถแยทแแแแแผแยทแแธยทแแแแปแยทแขแแแแ แ
แแพแยทแแถแยทแฎยทแแแแนแยทแแยทแแธยทแแแแแขแแแ
แถแแ แแบยทแแถแยทแแผแยทแแแแถแแยทแแถแยทแแแแแผแยทแฒแแยทแแ
แแแแปแยทแ
แแแแยทแแยทแแถแแทยทแแถแแยทแกแถแยทแแแยทแแถแแแยทแแถ "แ
แผแยทแแแแแยทแกแพแ !
แ
แผแยทแแพแยทแแแแแยทแกแพแยทแแแแพยทแ
แแแแถแแยทแแถแแยทแแทแยทแแ"</div></td></tr></tbody></table></blockquote><div dir="ltr" class="protonmail_signature_block-user" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;"><br></div><div class="protonmail_signature_block-user" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;">cf. Here's what it looks like with the ZWSP as the in<span style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">visible word </span>divider:</div><blockquote style="padding-left: 10px; border-left-width: 3px; border-left-style: solid; border-left-color: rgb(200, 200, 200);"><div class="protonmail_signature_block-user" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px; color: rgb(102, 102, 102);"><b>Obad.1.1</b></div><table class="protonmail_signature_block-user" style="width: 561pt; box-sizing: border-box; border-collapse: collapse; border-spacing: 0px;"><tbody><tr><td class="protonmail_signature_block-user" align="left" style="width: 561pt; height: 29.25pt; border-width: 0.5pt medium 0.5pt 0.5pt; border-style: solid none solid solid; border-color: white currentcolor white white; background-color: rgb(184, 204, 228); padding-top: 1px; padding-right: 1px; padding-left: 1px; vertical-align: top; color: black;"><div class="protonmail_signature_block-user" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-size: 11pt;">แแแโแแถโแแปแแทแโแแทแแทแแแโแแแแโแแแโแขแผแแถแแถ
แแแแแขแแแ
แถแแโแแถโแแแแโแแถแโแแแแแผแโแแธโแแแแปแโแขแแแแ แ
แแพแโแแถแโแฎโแแแแนแโแแโแแธโแแแแแขแแแ
แถแแ แแบโแแถแโแแผแโแแแแถแแโแแถแโแแแแแผแโแฒแแโแแ
แแแแปแโแ
แแแแโแแโแแถแแทโแแถแแโแกแถแโแแแโแแถแแแโแแถ "แ
แผแโแแแแแโแกแพแ !
แ
แผแโแแพแโแแแแแโแกแพแโแแแแพโแ
แแแแถแแโแแถแแโแแทแโแแ"</div></td></tr></tbody></table></blockquote><div dir="ltr" class="protonmail_signature_block-user" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;"><br></div><div class="protonmail_signature_block-user" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;">If SWORD developers agree that my proposal merits consideration, please would you start on the software development.</div><div dir="ltr" class="protonmail_signature_block-user" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;"><br></div><div dir="ltr" class="protonmail_signature_block-user" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;"><br></div><div class="protonmail_signature_block-user" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;">
Best regards,<br><br>David
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