[sword-devel] Bible in Myanmar
Cyrille
lafricain79 at gmail.com
Tue May 14 13:42:07 MST 2019
Il 14/05/2019 22:26, David Haslam ha scritto:
> If Michael’s observations are anything to go by, then maybe I can
> script the recovery of chapter & verse tags.
>
> We shall see ....
>
> Even if I’m not immediately successful - valuable lessons can be
> learned in the attempt.
Very, well, I'll wait for you ;)
>
> David
>
> Sent from ProtonMail Mobile
>
>
> On Tue, May 14, 2019 at 21:21, Cyrille <lafricain79 at gmail.com
> <mailto:lafricain79 at gmail.com>> wrote:
>> Ok thank you! I have already all the text in unicode but without the
>> verse numbers and chapters... I begun manually...
>>
>> Il 14/05/2019 22:17, David Haslam ha scritto:
>>> Hi Cyrille
>>>
>>> If I can find the time tomorrow or later, I’ll have a look at what
>>> might be feasible.
>>>
>>> Thanks for all these useful links.
>>>
>>> David
>>>
>>> Sent from ProtonMail Mobile
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tue, May 14, 2019 at 14:08, Cyrille <lafricain79 at gmail.com
>>> <mailto:lafricain79 at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>>> I send my message again because it was bigger.
>>>>
>>>> The conversion to UTF-8 is 99% solved!! I used a online converter:
>>>> https://thanlwinsoft.github.io/www.thanlwinsoft.org/ThanLwinSoft/MyanmarUnicode/Conversion/myanmarConverter.html
>>>> or:
>>>> http://burglish.my-mm.org/latest/trunk/web/fontconv.htm
>>>>
>>>> See the result here
>>>> <https://framadrop.org/r/jKnYnvuQIH#mE+FWcvzD1N/Omnfr7uWMZmI/HZUUVPdvnVVkBFyFrA=>.
>>>>
>>>> Now the only problem is how to get the verse and chapter number...
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Il 14/05/2019 13:53, Michael H ha scritto:
>>>>> Cyrille, (Peter),
>>>>>
>>>>> Maybe further discussion on this belongs in Gitlab as issues. Can
>>>>> I get added to this project?
>>>>>
>>>>> Here are the first few lines of Matthew copied from the PDF:
>>>>> ------
>>>>> &Sifrmaw;OD; {0Ha*vdusrf;
>>>>> The Gospel According to Matthew
>>>>> ed'gef;
>>>>> usr;f ûyy*k Kd¾v f &iS rf maw;O;D \b0rwS wf r;f
>>>>> usr;f ûyy*k Kd¾v f &iS rf maw;O;Don f *gavav;,e,rf S*sL;vrl sK;d
>>>>> tmvaf z;O;D \om;jzp\f / (rmu k2;14)
>>>>> olonf tcGefcHoltjzpf trIxrf;chJonf/ (vk 5;27)
>>>>> a,Zl;ocif\aemufvdkufwynfhrjzpfrD ol\trnfrSm
>>>>> av0djzp\f / ool n f wad b;&,d tidk tf e;DwGi f a,Z;lociEf iS ahf
>>>>> wG U Ny;D
>>>>>
>>>>> -----
>>>>> And here are the first few lines of Matthew copied from the
>>>>> Pagemaker file:
>>>>> -----
>>>>> Sifrmaw;OD; {0Ha*vdusrf;
>>>>> The Gospel According to Matthew
>>>>> ed'gef;
>>>>> usrf;�yyk*�dKvf &Sifrmaw;OD;\b0rSwfwrf;
>>>>> usrf;�yyk*�dKvf &Sifrmaw;OD;onf *gavav;,e,frS *sL;vlrsKd;
>>>>> tmvfaz;OD;\om;jzpf\/ (rmuk 2;14) olonf tcGefcHoltjzpf
>>>>> trIxrf;chJonf/ (vk 5;27) a,Zl;ocif\aemufvdkufwynfhrjzpfrD
>>>>> ol\trnfrSm av0djzpf\/ olonf wdab;&d,tkdifteD;wGif
>>>>> a,Zl;ocifESifhawGU NyD;
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> You can see that some letters have changed, and some others are in
>>>>> a different order.
>>>>>
>>>>> The letters that change are likely those points that aren't
>>>>> compatible with unicode, and pagemaker reassigned them to ensure
>>>>> that the file is more widely viewable. Since a conversion is
>>>>> already planned, these won't matter as much, but the font embedded
>>>>> in the PDF is different than the font attached to the pagemaker
>>>>> file, If you do start from the PDF, you'll need to extract the
>>>>> font to get the code points.
>>>>>
>>>>> The problem is that the PDF export from pagemaker sorts the
>>>>> letters into the order they appear on the page. Burmese text has
>>>>> Indian style ligatures, where vowels tend to jump over or under
>>>>> the previous letters, sometimes back 2 or three letters. If you
>>>>> study the following snippets from the beginning of Matthew, you
>>>>> can see there is a difference in order, as well as some glyphs are
>>>>> modified.
>>>>>
>>>>> So, from the PDF letters are out of order, but from Pagemaker,
>>>>> letters are encoded into control points. Fixing the control points
>>>>> is easy and happens with the unicode conversion. Fixing the
>>>>> letter order is not easy. You'll need a first language speaker and
>>>>> plenty of time.
>>>>>
>>>>> The guidance I received on another group was to use either LO Draw
>>>>> or Indesign to export the text from Pagemaker. I'll look into LO
>>>>> Draw again, but I don't have access to an older version of
>>>>> Indesign (the pagemaker import was removed in CS6).
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Mon, May 13, 2019 at 10:40 AM Michael H <cmahte at gmail.com
>>>>> <mailto:cmahte at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> I unzipped the pagemaker file, and when I open
>>>>> NT_Proverb/Pagemaker (10.1mb), with a Hex editor, I can 'find'
>>>>> all of the book names, and see the text there.
>>>>>
>>>>> To see the raw text: rename NT_Proverb.pmd > NT_Proverb.zip
>>>>> and open it with a zip archive progeram. The text is in the
>>>>> Pagemaker file at the top level of the archive, but encoded
>>>>> with a lot of extraneous information. (The English text
>>>>> "Matthew" appears at hex location 7A76972).
>>>>>
>>>>> When I open the fonts with fontforge, Fontforge suggests the
>>>>> fonts are encoded as unicode (but the glyphs are obviously not
>>>>> in the right spot.)
>>>>> However when I copy the text (I copied from LO Draw) and paste
>>>>> it into jedit and save that as unicode: Reopening the file has
>>>>> a warning 'not unicode, text may be missing'.
>>>>>
>>>>> So, what this means is that there are some glyphs encoded into
>>>>> locations that unicode treats as control or non-printing
>>>>> codes. The text needs to be dealt with as a specific encoding
>>>>> that matches whatever the original font actually uses. I
>>>>> haven't figured out what the original text files were encoded
>>>>> with. Without that knowledge, I'm not sure my system clipboard
>>>>> or editor (jedit) will properly respect the glyphs in unusual
>>>>> locations until the conversion to unicode, and I don't trust
>>>>> myself to be able to detect if it is or is not properly
>>>>> converted.
>>>>>
>>>>> On Mon, May 13, 2019 at 10:11 AM Cyrille
>>>>> <lafricain79 at gmail.com <mailto:lafricain79 at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> David,
>>>>> Probably you are right about TECkit
>>>>> <http://scripts.sil.org/cms/scripts/page.php?site_id=nrsi&cat_id=TECkit>,
>>>>> if we get the text it will help us to convert in UNICODE.
>>>>> About how to get the text, your method is out of my skills :)
>>>>> I you succeed please let me know.
>>>>>
>>>>> Il 13/05/2019 16:21, David Haslam ha scritto:
>>>>>> Given the insights from Michael Hart, it may be feasible
>>>>>> to temporarily rearrange the main text stream as follows :
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 1. Replace every EOL by a horizontal tab.
>>>>>> 2. Insert an EOL after each verse end character.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Observe that the above two steps are wholly reversible
>>>>>> such that the original text stream can be restored later.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> In effect the text stream is now in verse per line (VPL)
>>>>>> layout, albeit without verse tags. Some adjustments may
>>>>>> be necessary if there any section headings, etc.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 3. Add line numbers with the first number being reset to
>>>>>> 1 at the start of each chapter, numbers incrementing by 1
>>>>>> for each line.
>>>>>> 4. Add a left margin USFM verse tag \v_
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Steps 3&4 can be implemented in various ways. For my
>>>>>> part, I’d use a bespoke TextPipe filter.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Another method to consider might be to use Excel
>>>>>> formulae. I recall resorting to such a method in the
>>>>>> early days of Go Bible.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Now restore the original layout by reverting steps 2 & 1,
>>>>>> if this is really necessary. That is, if the original
>>>>>> text layout appeared to be paragraphed.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 5. Decide how & where to insert paragraph tags.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 6. Add chapter tags, book ID and main title tags, etc.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hope this gives some useful suggestions that point
>>>>>> towards a practical solution.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Best regards
>>>>>>
>>>>>> David
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Sent from ProtonMail Mobile
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Mon, May 13, 2019 at 14:57, Michael H
>>>>>> <cmahte at gmail.com <mailto:cmahte at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>>>>>> Cyrille
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> LibreOffice Draw attempts to open the pagemaker file,
>>>>>>> with limited success. But it confirms that even in the
>>>>>>> pagemaker source, the verse numbers are a separate text
>>>>>>> stream. With this source, there is no way to copy the
>>>>>>> text with verse numbers intact. It appears to be stored
>>>>>>> with each book in it's own text stream. Each book is a
>>>>>>> separate text stream in the page maker file. LO Draw
>>>>>>> isn't rendering all of the pages, only the first 10, So
>>>>>>> I've only explored Matthew further.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Based on Matthew only, the verses seem to all end with
>>>>>>> the character "-" or ";/", which should aid in the
>>>>>>> reconstruction. I've looked through the PDF and this
>>>>>>> seems to be the case for all books visually as well.
>>>>>>> However, this isn't perfect: I find 1107 of these
>>>>>>> characters in Matthew, instead of the expected 1071
>>>>>>> verses. But since the text stream has a book
>>>>>>> introduction, this is likely easily explained. Hopefully
>>>>>>> this gets you well down the path to creating a stream
>>>>>>> with verses.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I would NOT start from the PDF file, but from the
>>>>>>> pagemaker file. The PDF almost certainly has a lot of
>>>>>>> text rearranging and extra characters like page numbers
>>>>>>> and running heads. Pagemaker has the book text in a
>>>>>>> single stream, in a form that will convert to unicode
>>>>>>> relatively easily.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
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