[sword-devel] milestone element, osisRef attribute

[David Haslam]

Quite so!

And having studied the six instances where UYC.xml failed to validate on account of osisRef within a milestone element,
it does seem to me that what was required in each place is an osisID.

The milestone element location is not altogether different to the value of the attribute,
save for the use of multiple osisID to locate the text of both passages, because the sID/eID pair is for a verse range.

The different location is given by the annotateRef attribute within each milestone.

David

Sent from ProtonMail Mobile

On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 12:32, DM Smith <dmsmith at crosswire.org> wrote:

> Semantics:
> osisID marks the address of the current item.
> osisRef points the address of a different item that the current item references.
>
> I think that the osis manual gives a suggested mechanism for two v11ns in the same document. My computer is in the shop and I cannot check.
>
> — DM Smith
> From my phone. Brief. Weird autocorrections.
>
> On Sep 17, 2018, at 3:16 AM, David Haslam <dfhdfh at protonmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Thanks Horst for explaining.
>>
>> Why is osisRef used rather than osisID ?
>>
>> The latter would be valid to the schema.
>>
>> David
>>
>> Sent from ProtonMail Mobile
>>
>> On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 06:22, Horst Sclemmer <schlemmerhorst1731 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi all,
>>>
>>> It's good to see this discussion going on.
>>> I try to briefly explain the need for having the osisRef in a milestone.
>>> As many people are able to read Russian, most translations for languages
>>> in the former Soviet Union use the SynadalProt versification. So, people
>>> comparing their translation with Russian scriptures won't be confused.
>>> On the other hand most of the (former Soviet Union) scriptures don't
>>> follow the versification in every detail.
>>> A very common difference is the problem you see in the Uighur Cyrillic
>>> with Romans 14 and 16.
>>> As Peter already mentioned, there is an anomalie with the last three
>>> verses of Romans 14 and 16. Most western translations (KJV) follow
>>> manuscripts that have these verses in Romans 16:25-27, whereas
>>> SynodalProt has them in Romans 14:24-26.
>>> Romans 16:25-27 seems to be the better place to have them, so most
>>> Central Asian translations decided, not to follow the SynodalProt
>>> versification here.
>>>
>>> The milestone types "x-vsys-..." and annotateRef
>>> annotateTypes="x-vsys-..." are used to reference these moved verses to
>>> the right verses.
>>> See
>>> https://github.com/JohnAustinDev/osis-converters/blob/master/scripts/bible/osis2sourceVerseSystem.xsl
>>> for all the details and possible types.
>>> These milestone and annotateRef types are already used in a lot of OSIS
>>> files for scriptures in the IBT repository
>>> (http://ibt.org.ru/ftpmirror/pub/).
>>>
>>> I can remove the parts that are currently not supported by the OSIS schema.
>>> But as this is a general solution to deal with translations that vary
>>> from their versification, I would suggest to take the effort to adjust
>>> the OSIS schema and add the osisRef attribute to the milestone element.
>>>
>>> Kind regards
>>>
>>> Horst
>>>
>>> On 9/13/2018 6:21 PM, David Haslam wrote:
>>>> In the OSIS 2.1 Users Manual, for the milestone element only three attribute names are mentioned: type, n, marker
>>>>
>>>> The osisRef attribute is currently defined only for the following OSIS elements: catchWord, chapter, div, figure, note, q, reference
>>>>
>>>> If we wish to enhance the CrossWire updated OSIS schema, the request should be added as a new subsection in this wiki page:
>>>> https://wiki.crosswire.org/OSIS_211_CR
>>>>
>>>> What does the Uighur translation team envisage as the practical use of osisRef in the OSIS example given?
>>>> What would we expect SWORD to do with it?
>>>>
>>>> Best regards,
>>>>
>>>> David
>>>>
>>>> Sent with ProtonMail Secure Email.
>>>>
>>>> ‐‐‐‐‐‐‐ Original Message ‐‐‐‐‐‐‐
>>>> On Thursday, 13 September 2018 10:01, Peter von Kaehne <refdoc at gmx.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Deal all,
>>>>>
>>>>> I am in the process of uploading an update to our cyrillic Uygyur
>>>>> module.
>>>>>
>>>>> There are a few instances where the new text does not validate due to
>>>>> use of osisRef in the milestone element. The author asserts that
>>>>> osisRef should be possible inside the milestone element and I can not
>>>>> see any reason indeed why it should not - other than "the schema does
>>>>> not allow it". Below an example. The textual background is a manuscript
>>>>> anomaly in Romans 14 and 16, where a couple of verses appear commonly
>>>>> at the end of Romans 16, but in some manuscript in Romans 14.
>>>>>
>>>>> 30965 <verse osisID="Rom.14.23 Rom.14.24 Rom.14.25 Rom.14.26"
>>>>> sID="Rom.14.23 Rom.14.24 Rom.14.25 Rom.14.26" type="x-vsys-
>>>>> fitted"/><milestone type="x-vsys-verse-start" annotateRef="Rom.14.23"
>>>>> annotateType="x-vsys-source"/>Лекин бирәр йемәкликкә шәк кәлтүрүп
>>>>> туруп, йәнә шу йемәкликни йегән киши вижданиниң әйиплишигә учрайду.
>>>>> Чүнки у киши өзи йегән йемәкликниң тоғра екәнлигигә ишәнч қилалмиди.
>>>>> Тоғра екәнлигигә ишәнч йоқ һалда қилинған һәр қандақ иш
>>>>> гунадур.</p><milestone type="x-vsys-movedto" annotateRef="Rom.16.25"
>>>>> annotateType="x-vsys-source" osisRef="Rom.14.24"/><milestone type="x-
>>>>> vsys-movedto" annotateRef="Rom.16.26" annotateType="x-vsys-source"
>>>>> osisRef="Rom.14.25"/><milestone type="x-vsys-movedto"
>>>>> annotateRef="Rom.16.27" annotateType="x-vsys-source"
>>>>> osisRef="Rom.14.26"/><verse eID="Rom.14.23 Rom.14.24 Rom.14.25
>>>>> Rom.14.26" type="x-vsys-fitted"/><milestone type="x-vsys-verse-end"
>>>>> annotateRef="Rom.14.23" annotateType="x-vsys-source"/>
>>>>>
>>>>> Any views? Should the schema be updated or should I reject the module
>>>>> in its current form?
>>>>>
>>>>> Peter
>>>>>
>>>>> sword-devel mailing list: sword-devel at crosswire.org
>>>>> http://www.crosswire.org/mailman/listinfo/sword-devel
>>>>> Instructions to unsubscribe/change your settings at above page
>>>>
>>>>
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