From sderose at acm.org  Wed Jul  7 10:54:11 2004
From: sderose at acm.org (Steven J. DeRose)
Date: Wed Jul  7 11:12:02 2004
Subject: [osis-core] Add <verse> to <inscription>]
Message-ID: <a06020406bd11d8997fe5@[205.219.48.174]>

>Subject: Re: [osis-core] Add <verse> to <inscription>
>Date: Sat, 12 Jun 2004 17:03:19 -0400
>From: Patrick Durusau <Patrick.Durusau@sbl-site.org>
>Reply-To: osis-core@bibletechnologieswg.org
>To: osis-core@bibletechnologieswg.org
>References: <002a01c44e3e$4975eae0$657fa8c0@BLUELIGHT>
>
>Todd,
>
>Todd Tillinghast wrote:
>>  Can we add <verse> to <inscription>, so that a verse can start/end
>>  within an inscription?
>>
>
>Do you have an example of this?
>
>In other words, an inscription that contains a verse (the thing in
>itself) as opposed to the typography of someone recording such a thing?
>(Is there a difference?)
>
>To illustrate:
>
>On the wall of my office: <inscription> Patrick likes to quote the
>Bible, where it says: <verse>Why do you call for the day of the
>Lord?</verse><verse>The day of the Lord is darkness and not
>light.</verse></inscription>
>
>That is a verse appears in an incription that someone may be reporting
>in a text and the markup reflects the structure of the inscription as
>observed.

I can't think of any Biblical cases; is it likely to show up in 
extra-Biblical materials any time soon (most of which probably won't 
have verses anyway...)?

From sderose at acm.org  Wed Jul  7 10:57:52 2004
From: sderose at acm.org (Steven J. DeRose)
Date: Wed Jul  7 11:12:03 2004
Subject: [osis-core] Re: [Fwd: Example of work]
In-Reply-To: <40EC107E.7030701@sbl-site.org>
References: <40EC107E.7030701@sbl-site.org>
Message-ID: <a06020407bd11e957a763@[205.219.48.174]>

>Subject: Example of work
>Date: Wed, 16 Jun 2004 17:13:30 -0400
>From: Patrick Durusau <Patrick.Durusau@sbl-site.org>
>To: osis-core@bibletechnologieswg.org
>
>Guys,
>
>Gary Edwards sent me some very good comments on the users manual which I
>   am working through at the moment.
>
>On osisWork we have the example:
>
><![CDATA[
><work osisWork="EG">
>      <title>Egyptian Grammar</title>
>      <creator role="aut">Alan Gardiner</creator>
>      <contributor role="dte">Francis Llewellyn Griffith</contributor>
>      <date event="original" type="gregorian">1927</date>
>      <date event="eversion" type="gregorian">2003</date>
>      <type type="x-grammar">Grammar</type>
>      <publisher>Griffith Institute, Ashmolean Museum, Oxford</publisher>
>      <language type="ISO-639">EN</language>
>      <language type="Ethnologue">EG-ancient</language>
>      <identifier type="ISBN">0900416351</identifier>
>      <identifier type="LCCN">95230980</identifer>
></work>
>]]>
>
>Gary points out:
>
>1. Confusing since the osisWork attribute has "EG" which is the same as
>the first part of the Ethnologue code. Note we refer to it being a
>prefix, yikes, the Ethnologue folks use it like a prefix. Hmmm, bad joss.
>
>Suggestion:
>
>EG on osisWork becomes Gardiner1927 (he published a lot of stuff)

Sounds like a very good change to me.

>
>Add both osisID and osisRefs that use the Gardiner1927 prefix, something
>like, "While elsewhere in the text you may see.... and put in uses of
>osisID and osisRef using this work. (I have a copy of this within arm's
>reach so I can put in some passages.)

Yup.

>
>Well, while we are at it, do the same for the Cotton Patch Gospels. But
>there keep the CPG as a different example of the osisWork attribute value.

Ok

>
>Does anybody have a copy of the Cotton Patch Gospels handy? I have a
>copy somewhere and if I every get the shelves built in my office I may
>be able to get organized again.

I have at least Luke on my shelf. And probably some of the <warning 
type="brace-yourself" target="Patrick">Pauline epistles</warning> too.

>
>If you do, please throw together osisID and osisRefs to particular
>passages. A short part of a passage would not hurt. The manual is fairly
>dull reading and some good writing would probably be a welcome break.

Ok, will try to do that tomorrow.


From Patrick.Durusau at sbl-site.org  Thu Jul  8 05:32:51 2004
From: Patrick.Durusau at sbl-site.org (Patrick Durusau)
Date: Thu Jul  8 05:40:57 2004
Subject: [osis-core] Multiple uses of type
Message-ID: <40ED3EF3.6050303@sbl-site.org>

Guys,

Just an FYI on our use of "type."

Ran across this in John Edward's excellent comments on the draft where 
he used attribute for "type" when talking about the header.

Note that "type" is a Dublin core element in <work>, and is also used as 
an attribute on most of our elements.

Suggest that we always clearly distinguish <type> in a <work> element as 
being different from type as an attribute.

Hope everyone is at the start of a great day!

Patrick

-- 
Patrick Durusau
Director of Research and Development
Society of Biblical Literature
Patrick.Durusau@sbl-site.org
Chair, V1 - Text Processing: Office and Publishing Systems Interface
Co-Editor, ISO 13250, Topic Maps -- Reference Model

Topic Maps: Human, not artificial, intelligence at work!


From sderose at acm.org  Fri Jul  9 08:06:26 2004
From: sderose at acm.org (Steven J. DeRose)
Date: Fri Jul  9 08:42:58 2004
Subject: [osis-core] Protestant, DC, and Cathloc edition Bible book
	names 	and overlap
In-Reply-To: <40B36914.6030107@sbl-site.org>
References: <000901c42964$de6fe500$687fa8c0@BLUELIGHT>
	<40B36914.6030107@sbl-site.org>
Message-ID: <a0602040dbd146434a1fd@[192.168.1.112]>

>Todd,
>
>Todd Tillinghast wrote:
>>In Protestant and Interconfessional Bibles Daniel only has 12 chapters.
>>
>>In Catholic Bibles Daniel 13 is the same as the interconfessional
>>Sussana and Daniel 14 the same as interconfessional Bel and the Dragon.
>>
>>It is a similar issue for Esther/AddEsth and a few other DC books that
>>are separate in interconfessional editions.
>>
>>We have allocated OSIS Bible book names for all of the "books" that are
>>separate in interconfessional editions.
>>
>>Question 1: What is the best practice for OSIS ids for these passages?
>>1) Only use the interconfessional OSIS Bible book id in all cases for
>>consistency.
>>2) Only use the OSIS Bible book name (Daniel.13) that is used in the
>>Protestant and Catholic editions (this would imply that we should
>>eliminate the DC Bible book names).
>>3) Use the OSIS Bible book name (Daniel.13) when the text is combined
>>with what is accepted as the Protestant text and use the DC OSIS Bible
>>book name when it stands alone.
>>4) Use either or both OSIS Bible book names in all cases.
>>
>>Question 2: In the January meeting we touched on the issue of marking
>>cross-references to DC Books with a marker, I think <seg type="x-dc">.
>>A bigger question has been raised by the folks at the UBS.  Can they
>>encode in a single set of files (they call a "database") a translation
>>that will be rendered for Protestant, Catholic, and Interconfessional
>>audiences?
>>
>>My opinion is by all means yes.  I see four options:
>>1) We suggest that they mark the texts using both the DC and Catholic
>>OSIS Bible book names where both apply and then render the books they
>>want using the OSIS ids.  The only trick is that there would be "book
>>introductions" to the DC books that would not apply in the other
>>editions.  It would seem that these should be marked using something
>>like <seg type="x-dc">.
>>
>
>I think we need to separate out the issue of how do I identify (for 
>processing) a portion of a work versus what does the user see after 
>it has been processed.
>
>Are we all in agreement that the OSIS enumerated Bible book names 
>cover all of the possible portions of texts? That is, we assign a 
>unique name to each separable portion?

Those seem like 2 different questions. Yes, we have sufficient names; 
but I don't think we've said anywhere that you have to call this 
thing Bel instead of Dan 14. Should we not say that?

>
>Err, yes the overlap of DC book names is a problem. Really should 
>just have set unique ids and what a book is composed up being left 
>to the user to include any number of uniquely indentified smaller 
>chunks of material.
>
>Well, but we did not do that. :-(
>
>This one looks like the best of the lot.

??

>
>And yes, they can use the osisIDs to create a database of what 
>should be included in different versions. At least as far as the 
>biblical text. Could use your suggestions of <seg type="x-dc"> but 
>using type on the container element, say I want to have three 
>introductions to Matthew, one Protestant, one Catholic and one 
>interdenominational, seems like I should be able to do that with 
>attribute selections.
>
>Responses the other suggestions below.
>
>Hope you are having a great day!
>
>Patrick
>
>>2) We suggest that the best practice is to mark with something like <seg
>>type="x-dc"> and <seg type="x-interconfessional"> the entire blocks of
>>text that belong to the different editions.
>>
>
>No.
>
>>3) We suggest that they create three encodings (with three different
>><identifier type="OSIS"> values).
>>
>
>No.
>
>>4) We suggest nothing and every man does what is right in his own eyes.
>>
>
>No.
>
>>Any solutions?
>>
>>(On an interesting note, I believe that the translation that has brought
>>up these issues is the first Bible that is being encoded as an OSIS
>>document BEFORE it has been printed.)


-- 

Steve DeRose -- http://www.derose.net
Chair, Bible Technologies Group -- http://www.bibletechnologies.net
Email: sderose@acm.org  or  steve@derose.net
From sderose at acm.org  Fri Jul  9 08:15:13 2004
From: sderose at acm.org (Steven J. DeRose)
Date: Fri Jul  9 08:43:02 2004
Subject: [osis-core] scope attribute on <p>, <lg>, <list>, and <table>
In-Reply-To: <000c01c44275$a0bfd5b0$647fa8c0@BLUELIGHT>
References: <000c01c44275$a0bfd5b0$647fa8c0@BLUELIGHT>
Message-ID: <a0602040ebd1466ac35ff@[192.168.1.112]>

At 10:30 -0600 2004-05-25, Todd Tillinghast wrote:
>In talking with a group attempting to use OSIS documents within
>Documentum they are struggling with the fact that Bibles and thus OSIS
>documents have multiple overlapping hierarchies which is a problem with
>Documentum's architecture that requires that documents be broken in to
>"chunks".
>
>The best solution will like be for them to "chunk" OSIS documents at the
><p>, <lg>, <list>, <table> level.  Because the common access pattern is
>likely to be based on Book/Chapter/Verse reference it would be handy if
>the "scope" attribute were available on these elements in the same way
>it is with <div>.
>
>Any objections to or reasons why we should not add "scope" to "large"
>containers (<p>, <lg>, <list>, <table>, <speech> and possibly <signed>
>and <salute>)?
>

I guess I have no objection to that, though accommodating 
Documentum's prehistoric "chunking" doctrine tastes bad. Why don't 
they just chunk however they want, but keep track of the applicable 
osisIDs for each chunk as they load, so they can search on them? 
Doesn't sound too tough to me.

-- 

Steve DeRose -- http://www.derose.net
Chair, Bible Technologies Group -- http://www.bibletechnologies.net
Email: sderose@acm.org  or  steve@derose.net
From sderose at acm.org  Fri Jul  9 08:18:23 2004
From: sderose at acm.org (Steven J. DeRose)
Date: Fri Jul  9 08:43:03 2004
Subject: [osis-core] type for <l>
In-Reply-To: <40B39CB7.9080507@sbl-site.org>
References: <40B39CB7.9080507@sbl-site.org>
Message-ID: <a0602040fbd14671b5035@[192.168.1.112]>

At 15:21 -0400 2004-05-25, Patrick Durusau wrote:
>Greetings!
>
>Some type ago Todd asked about using the following types for lines 
>(he got this from Jim Albright):
>
>refrain
>interlude
>doxology
>
>We bounced it back and forth but really came to no real conclusion.
>
>While reading the email traffic it occurred to me that these are not 
>really line types, although they may only apply to one line.
>
>They are really lineGroup types that may contain one or more lines.
>
>Think about it. Sometimes there are one line refrains, but not 
>really all that often, particularly in liturgical settings. Same 
>thing for a doxology. Not as sure about interlude because I don't 
>recall how Jim is using the term.
>
>Any thoughts on creating enumerated types for lineGroup?

Seems fine to me, and I agree these types go there rather than on 
line. If we were going to do types for line they'd probably want to 
be things like metrical form (yeah, I know that doesn't matter for 
Hebrew).

What other types should there be, then? Prayer? Prophecy? Proverb? 
Verse (as in song-part)?


>
>That does have the impact of making lineGroup necessary even if you 
>do have only one line but suspect that is the minority of the cases.

Yes, but only when you want to attach such an attribute.

>
>Jim, since this was your question, what do you think?
>

From sderose at acm.org  Fri Jul  9 08:22:29 2004
From: sderose at acm.org (Steven J. DeRose)
Date: Fri Jul  9 08:43:04 2004
Subject: [osis-core] Defaulting (repetition)
In-Reply-To: <40B3B2B6.6000503@sbl-site.org>
References: <40B3B2B6.6000503@sbl-site.org>
Message-ID: <a06020410bd1467f5833a@[192.168.1.112]>

At 16:55 -0400 2004-05-25, Patrick Durusau wrote:
>Greetings!
>
>I posted a note back in February on a more general defaulting 
>mechanism that did not see much play on the list. (Todd responded 
>but then Todd always does. ;-) This time with a question and not an 
>objection so it was different in that regard.)
>
>The proposal is as follows:
>
>Add to <header> the following element (repeatable without limit, 
>except that two such elements cannot conflict):
>
><setDefault>
>
>Has two attributes:
>
>path: which must be of the form: //GI@attributeName
>
>and
>
>prefix: value must be found on a work element in the current 
>document as the value of osisWork attribute.
>
>This will allow all the current defaulting plus defaulting on 
>lemmas, morphology, etc., and any other that comes up in the future 
>without further intervention on our part.
>
>Current mechanisms will persist but if both apply, the newer 
>mechanism takes precedence.

I really like the functionality and generality.

Todd's right that it should conform entirely to XPath syntax, I think.

It is kind of a pain to introduce Yet Another Defaulting Mechanism, though....

-- 

Steve DeRose -- http://www.derose.net
Chair, Bible Technologies Group -- http://www.bibletechnologies.net
Email: sderose@acm.org  or  steve@derose.net
From sderose at acm.org  Fri Jul  9 08:24:41 2004
From: sderose at acm.org (Steven J. DeRose)
Date: Fri Jul  9 08:43:06 2004
Subject: [osis-core] FW: [osis-user] USFM \nd --> TE 'Name Of God' <--OSIS
In-Reply-To: <001a01c4444c$70b2b620$647fa8c0@BLUELIGHT>
References: <001a01c4444c$70b2b620$647fa8c0@BLUELIGHT>
Message-ID: <a06020411bd14691ac806@[192.168.1.112]>

At 18:40 -0600 2004-05-27, Todd Tillinghast wrote:
>Chris,
>
>I don't recall the discussion (nor dispute what you are saying). 
>
>With this meaning then the type attribute would be wrong to add.

True; and we should gives examples and clear doc.

>
>Todd
>
>>  -----Original Message-----
>>  From: osis-core-bounces@bibletechnologieswg.org [mailto:osis-core-
>>  bounces@bibletechnologieswg.org] On Behalf Of Chris Little
>>  Sent: Thursday, May 27, 2004 3:40 PM
>>  To: osis-core@bibletechnologieswg.org
>>  Cc: Jim_Albright@wycliffe.org
>>  Subject: Re: [osis-core] FW: [osis-user] USFM \nd --> TE 'Name Of God'
><--
>>  OSIS
>>
>>  I strongly object.  (We actually had this discussion at the meeting in
>>  Dallas just over a year ago.)
>>
>>  The only valid use of <divineName> is for translations of underlying
>>  Hebrew Yahweh, so this is implied and redundant.  Marking El, Elohim,
>or
>>  Dagon with <divineName> would be equally incorrect usage.
><divineName>
>>  was added specifically and only for the tetragrammaton.
>>
>>  --Chris
>>
>>  On Thu, 27 May 2004, Todd Tillinghast wrote:
>>
>>  > I agree with Jim.
>>  >
>>  > We should add <divineName type="yhwh">.
>>  >
>>  > Any objections?
>>  >
>>  > Todd
>>  >
>>  > -----Original Message-----
>>  > From: Jim_Albright@wycliffe.org [mailto:Jim_Albright@wycliffe.org]
>>  > Sent: Thursday, May 27, 2004 1:23 PM
>>  > To: osis-user@whi.wts.edu
>>  > Subject: RE: [osis-user] USFM \nd --> TE 'Name Of God' <--OSIS
>>  >
>>  > enumerated attributes requested
>>  >
>>  >
>>  > <osis:devineName @type='yhwh'> for Lord in the OT when the
>underlying
>>  > text
>>  > is YHWH.
>>  >
>>  >
>>  > Jim Albright
>>  > 704 843-0582
>>  > Wycliffe Bible Translators
>>  >
>>  >
>>  >
>>  >
>>  >
>>
>>  _______________________________________________
>>  osis-core mailing list
>>  osis-core@bibletechnologieswg.org
>>  http://www.bibletechnologieswg.org/mailman/listinfo/osis-core
>
>_______________________________________________
>osis-core mailing list
>osis-core@bibletechnologieswg.org
>http://www.bibletechnologieswg.org/mailman/listinfo/osis-core


-- 

Steve DeRose -- http://www.derose.net
Chair, Bible Technologies Group -- http://www.bibletechnologies.net
Email: sderose@acm.org  or  steve@derose.net
From sderose at acm.org  Fri Jul  9 08:26:30 2004
From: sderose at acm.org (Steven J. DeRose)
Date: Fri Jul  9 08:43:07 2004
Subject: [osis-core] Names for the versification systems
In-Reply-To: <003d01c44cad$d42627a0$657fa8c0@BLUELIGHT>
References: <003d01c44cad$d42627a0$657fa8c0@BLUELIGHT>
Message-ID: <a06020412bd14696edb9f@[192.168.1.112]>

Does anyone have these standardized names available or can find them 
quick? We have 4 provisional names in the doc if I remember right, 
but we'd need the 5th and I for one would rather go with names 
somebody has already got in use.

At 10:38 -0600 2004-06-07, Todd Tillinghast wrote:
>Kees,
>
>In Paratext there are standardized reference systems that are referred
>to by number (1-5 I believe).  We talked about adopting the UBS set of
>reference systems in the January meeting.
>
>Could you send us the "names" of these reference systems for
>consideration relative to designating "standardized" values for the
><referenceSystem> element in <work>?
>
>Todd
>
>_______________________________________________
>osis-core mailing list
>osis-core@bibletechnologieswg.org
>http://www.bibletechnologieswg.org/mailman/listinfo/osis-core


-- 

Steve DeRose -- http://www.derose.net
Chair, Bible Technologies Group -- http://www.bibletechnologies.net
Email: sderose@acm.org  or  steve@derose.net
From sderose at acm.org  Fri Jul  9 08:34:02 2004
From: sderose at acm.org (Steven J. DeRose)
Date: Fri Jul  9 08:43:09 2004
Subject: [osis-core] Add <verse> to <inscription>
In-Reply-To: <000801c45210$5e8b0520$0b00a8c0@BLUELIGHT>
References: <000801c45210$5e8b0520$0b00a8c0@BLUELIGHT>
Message-ID: <a06020413bd1469c3ef71@[192.168.1.112]>

At 07:06 -0600 2004-06-14, Todd Tillinghast wrote:
>Patrick and Kees,
>
>The case that I am certain occurs is where the end of an <inscription>
>and the end of a <verse> (almost always a milestone) coincide. 
>
>In general we have not specified a guideline(s) regarding what to do
>with overlapping hierarchies when their starting and ending boundaries
>coincide.

True; I think we should state it as a requirement that when overlap 
is gratuitous (that is, when there are 2 or more indifferent 
placements for a start or end milestone), then the milestone should 
be placed so as to avoid overlap between the pseudo-element and any 
regular element(s).

>
>The following is not possible with the current schema:
><verse osisID="..." sID="A"/>...<inscription>.........<verse
>eID="A"/></inscription>.
>
>I don't think there has been very much experience with using
><inscription> because it is one of the elements that often requires
>manual intervention when converting from SFM/USFM (where the many of the
>text are originating from) to OSIS.  As we see greater use I think we
>will see cases where a <verse> starts in the middle of an <inscription>.
>
>Kees, can you comment on the possibility/likelihood of a verse starting
>in the middle of an <inscription>?
>
>Todd

That seems a different question than is posed by the example above -- 
also a good question, though. I think it doesn't happen among the 
handful of inscriptions in the Bible. And though it will surely show 
up in the Pseudepigrapha or some completely non-Biblical historical 
source, perhaps they won't have verses. I'm ok either way on this one.

>
>
>
>>  -----Original Message-----
>>  From: osis-core-bounces@bibletechnologieswg.org [mailto:osis-core-
>>  bounces@bibletechnologieswg.org] On Behalf Of Patrick Durusau
>>  Sent: Saturday, June 12, 2004 3:03 PM
>>  To: osis-core@bibletechnologieswg.org
>>  Subject: Re: [osis-core] Add <verse> to <inscription>
>>
>>  Todd,
>>
>>  Todd Tillinghast wrote:
>>  > Can we add <verse> to <inscription>, so that a verse can start/end
>>  > within an inscription?
>>  >
>>
>>  Do you have an example of this?
>>
>>  In other words, an inscription that contains a verse (the thing in
>>  itself) as opposed to the typography of someone recording such a
>thing?
>>  (Is there a difference?)
>>
>>  To illustrate:
>>
>>  On the wall of my office: <inscription> Patrick likes to quote the
>>  Bible, where it says: <verse>Why do you call for the day of the
>>  Lord?</verse><verse>The day of the Lord is darkness and not
>>  light.</verse></inscription>
>>
>>  That is a verse appears in an incription that someone may be reporting
>>  in a text and the markup reflects the structure of the inscription as
>>  observed.
>>
>>  Does that make any sense?
>>
>>  Hope you are having a great day!
>>
>>  Patrick
>>
>>
>>  > Todd
>>  >
>>  > _______________________________________________
>>  > osis-core mailing list
>>  > osis-core@bibletechnologieswg.org
>>  > http://www.bibletechnologieswg.org/mailman/listinfo/osis-core
>>  >
>>
>>
>>  --
>>  Patrick Durusau
>>  Director of Research and Development
>>  Society of Biblical Literature
>>  Patrick.Durusau@sbl-site.org
>>  Chair, V1 - Text Processing: Office and Publishing Systems Interface
>>  Co-Editor, ISO 13250, Topic Maps -- Reference Model
>>
>>  Topic Maps: Human, not artificial, intelligence at work!
>>
>>
>>  _______________________________________________
>>  osis-core mailing list
>>  osis-core@bibletechnologieswg.org
>>  http://www.bibletechnologieswg.org/mailman/listinfo/osis-core
>
>_______________________________________________
>osis-core mailing list
>osis-core@bibletechnologieswg.org
>http://www.bibletechnologieswg.org/mailman/listinfo/osis-core


-- 

Steve DeRose -- http://www.derose.net
Chair, Bible Technologies Group -- http://www.bibletechnologies.net
Email: sderose@acm.org  or  steve@derose.net
From todd at contentframeworks.com  Fri Jul  9 15:05:54 2004
From: todd at contentframeworks.com (Todd Tillinghast)
Date: Fri Jul  9 15:13:54 2004
Subject: [osis-core] scope attribute on <p>, <lg>, <list>, and <table>
In-Reply-To: <a0602040ebd1466ac35ff@[192.168.1.112]>
Message-ID: <002401c46600$ead00130$6400a8c0@BLUELIGHT>

> -----Original Message-----
> From: osis-core-bounces@bibletechnologieswg.org [mailto:osis-core-
> bounces@bibletechnologieswg.org] On Behalf Of Steven J. DeRose
> Sent: Friday, July 09, 2004 9:15 AM
> To: osis-core@bibletechnologieswg.org
> Subject: Re: [osis-core] scope attribute on <p>, <lg>, <list>, and
<table>
> 
> At 10:30 -0600 2004-05-25, Todd Tillinghast wrote:
> >In talking with a group attempting to use OSIS documents within
> >Documentum they are struggling with the fact that Bibles and thus
OSIS
> >documents have multiple overlapping hierarchies which is a problem
with
> >Documentum's architecture that requires that documents be broken in
to
> >"chunks".
> >
> >The best solution will like be for them to "chunk" OSIS documents at
the
> ><p>, <lg>, <list>, <table> level.  Because the common access pattern
is
> >likely to be based on Book/Chapter/Verse reference it would be handy
if
> >the "scope" attribute were available on these elements in the same
way
> >it is with <div>.
> >
> >Any objections to or reasons why we should not add "scope" to "large"
> >containers (<p>, <lg>, <list>, <table>, <speech> and possibly
<signed>
> >and <salute>)?
> >
> 
> I guess I have no objection to that, though accommodating
> Documentum's prehistoric "chunking" doctrine tastes bad. 

I share the same distaste.

> Why don't they just chunk however they want, but keep track of the
> applicable osisIDs for each chunk as they load, so they can search on
them?
> Doesn't sound too tough to me.

This may make sense because they won't be guaranteed that all text will
make use of the "scope" attribute even if it is provided.

At the same time there is no real harm in providing the scope attribute.
I could go either way.

Todd


From sderose at acm.org  Sun Jul 11 06:07:22 2004
From: sderose at acm.org (Steven J. DeRose)
Date: Sun Jul 11 12:37:15 2004
Subject: [osis-core] Validator....
Message-ID: <a06020400bd16eb546137@[192.168.1.112]>

Here's a Java OSIS validator..... Not especially pretty, but it will 
check a lot of requirements on Trojan milestone usage, and will 
generate a bunch of generally useful statistics. Have fun.

S

-- 

Steve DeRose -- http://www.derose.net
Chair, Bible Technologies Group -- http://www.bibletechnologies.net
Email: sderose@acm.org  or  steve@derose.net
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From todd at contentframeworks.com  Thu Jul 22 13:40:13 2004
From: todd at contentframeworks.com (Todd Tillinghast)
Date: Thu Jul 22 13:48:21 2004
Subject: [osis-core] Structure for the value of <identifier type="OSIS">
Message-ID: <001201c4702c$1c970df0$647fa8c0@BLUELIGHT>

One of the key items that needs to be resolved prior to the release of
OSIS.2.1 is the structure for the value of <identifier type="OSIS">.

You can look back at past posts for the details but the main issue is
related to how fall back would work related to the selected structure.

The proposed structure would consist of the following "." separated
elements.
Proposed Elements:
1) Type of document: Bible, Sermon, Commentary, ReferenceSystem, ...
with these values defined by the OSIS committee.
2) Language: ISO two or three letter languages in lower case or
Ethnologue three letter code in upper case
3) Organization/Publisher code: ABS for the American Bible Society, WBTI
for Wycliffe Bible Translators International, DanielToddTillinghast for
me as individual, etc...
4) Title or commonly accepted code for the work (KJV, NIV, NASB, ...)
5) Date/Year
6) Other values used by the organization

Examples:
Bible.es.ABS.RVR.1960
Bible.es.ABS.RVR.1995
Bible.en.IBS.NIV.1984
Bible.QUT.WBTI.QUT.1997
Sermon.en.DanielToddTillinghast.WhyPigsFly.2004

The benefit is that all values after the Organization/Publisher code are
managed by the publisher.  However, an issue arises with works that are
published by multiple organizations such as the KJV, RVR, etc....

In the case of the RVR if someone were to simply specify
Bible.es.ABS.RVR it would be up to the user or software to pick one of
the two available editions.  However, you would exclude
Bible.es.?.RVR.1909 as an option.

OPTIONS:
OPTION 1: Use the form Bible.es.RVR.1960.ABS (Puts the organization last
for cases where there are multiple groups claiming to have a year
dependant version of the same work)

OPTION 2: Use the form Bible.es.RVR.ABS.1960 (Puts the date/year last
because date/year is most often dependant of the organization
publishing)

OPTOIN 3: Use the form Bible.es.ABS.RVR.1960 (Puts the organization
before the tile and date/year because in almost all cases other than
public domain texts the values are assigned by the organization and the
organization is the most important value.  This will be the case for the
largest number of translations where what is important to know is the
language and who did the translation.)

For cases other than Bibles I suspect the organization is the most
important element between the organization, title, and date/year.

How do we settle on a solution?

Todd