[osis-core] Should we allow <divineName> in <catchWord>
Patrick Durusau
osis-core@bibletechnologieswg.org
Wed, 14 May 2003 05:32:32 -0400
Todd,
Working on a technical issues agenda for the meeting.
What do you think the "just the end or just the start quote mark" means
in the CEV? Is it just slavish repetition of the apperance of the mark
in the text quoted (my position) or is it mean to act as something else?
Just want to make sure I capture what structure you think it is
indicating (if any) and since I don't see it, asking how you would say it.
Hope the day is off to a great start!
Patrick
Todd Tillinghast wrote:
>Yes we should discuss in Dallas.
>
>In the CEV there a couple of cases where the range of the catchWord
>includes just the end or just the start quote mark.
>
>Todd
>
>
>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: osis-core-admin@bibletechnologieswg.org
>>[mailto:osis-core-admin@bibletechnologieswg.org] On Behalf Of
>>Patrick Durusau
>>Sent: Tuesday, May 13, 2003 5:28 PM
>>To: osis-core@bibletechnologieswg.org
>>Subject: Re: [osis-core] Should we allow <divineName> in <catchWord>
>>
>>
>>Todd,
>>
>>Todd Tillinghast wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>>Patrick,
>>>
>>>Welcome back to this side of the pond.
>>>
>>>I think one thing that I came across more than any other case was
>>>quotes. In some cases unbalanced quotes. Because the <q>
>>>
>>>
>>element is
>>
>>
>>>not allowed, I just the standard double quote character.
>>>
>>>Are you of the opinion that quotes within a <catchWord> should be
>>>simple characters and not a <q> or milestone element?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>Not sure what an "unbalanced quote" would indicate? If you want to
>>include it, I would suggest just treating it as a character, although
>>you may have to use an entity for it.
>>
>>We can discuss in Dallas but I really do think that
>><catchWord> really
>>is just a string with no structure. We included the few other child
>>elements, probably a mistake in hindsight, so that encoding could be
>>entered that would take the reader to other references, expansions of
>>abbreviations, etc., from right there in the <catchWord>. Probably
>>should have made them go back to the text.
>>
>>Patrick
>>
>>
>>
>>>(I was thinking that an unbalanced quote could be represented by a
>>>single milestone.)
>>>
>>>Todd
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>>From: osis-core-admin@bibletechnologieswg.org [mailto:osis-core-
>>>>admin@bibletechnologieswg.org] On Behalf Of Patrick Durusau
>>>>Sent: Tuesday, May 13, 2003 6:56 AM
>>>>To: osis-core@bibletechnologieswg.org
>>>>Subject: Re: [osis-core] Should we allow <divineName> in <catchWord>
>>>>
>>>>Todd,
>>>>
>>>>Todd Tillinghast wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Patrick,
>>>>>
>>>>><catchWord> has been pretty difficult to work with. I think we
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>should
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>>either include all of the options available in normal text OR make
>>>>>catchWord have only a sequence of one or more <reference> elements
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>that
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>>refer to the current document AND use the grain. Multiple
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>><reference>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>>elements would be used if there are ellipsis are desired.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>Maybe it is the jet lag or more likely just being dense but
>>>>
>>>>
>>I really
>>
>>
>>>>don't see the difficulty in working with <catchWord>.
>>>>
>>>>Let's assume that you have <divineName> in the text and in
>>>>
>>>>
>><catchWord>
>>
>>
>>>>which appears in a note on the same page. Do you really
>>>>
>>>>
>>want to find
>>
>>
>>>>duplicate references to the same occurrence of <divineName> just
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>because
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>it appears in what is a textual clue to what is being addressed in a
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>note?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>In most cases, <catchWord> should only contain a text
>>>>
>>>>
>>string, no other
>>
>>
>>>>elements, although we allowed a few so references could be embedded,
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>etc..
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>I have yet to imagine or hear any reason why you want to allow this
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>sort
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>of markup in <catchWord>. Certainly no way to constrain it to match
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>the
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>markup that is found in the main text, which it is supposed to be
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>drawn
>>>
>>>
>>>>from so it looks more like a source of problems than anything else.
>>>
>>>
>>>>I have some sympathy for requiring use of references only but that
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>would
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>not be backwards compatible and would impose a burden on users who
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>want
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>to use <catchWord> properly, that is to be a short string
>>>>
>>>>
>>that draws
>>
>>
>>>>your attention to a portion of the main text.
>>>>
>>>>Hope you are having a great day!
>>>>
>>>>Patrick
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Todd
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>>>>From: osis-core-admin@bibletechnologieswg.org [mailto:osis-core-
>>>>>>admin@bibletechnologieswg.org] On Behalf Of Patrick Durusau
>>>>>>Sent: Tuesday, May 13, 2003 4:33 AM
>>>>>>To: osis-core@bibletechnologieswg.org
>>>>>>Subject: Re: [osis-core] Should we allow <divineName> in
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>><catchWord>
>>
>>
>>>>>>Todd,
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Todd Tillinghast wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Currently <catchword> does not allow <divineName> as a child. I
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>have
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>a
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>case where LORD is a part of a <catchWord>.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Should we add <divineName> as a child of <catchword>.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>Not sure why you would want to add <divineName> to <catchword>.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Tis true that the <divineName> occurs in the catchword
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>but probably
>>
>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>true
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>that every other structure could possibly occur there as well, at
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>least
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>if you consider what is in the main text. The question to me
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>revolves
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>around what you consider to be the function of the <catchword>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>element.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>I see it as capturing the text string that appears in the
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>main text
>>
>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>as
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>a
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>prompt to the reader, an implied hyperlink if you like, as to what
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>is
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>being discussed. It is not meant to represent the structure of the
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>text
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>that appears in the main text.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Is the problem one of display? Actually <catchWord> lacks <hi>,
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>which
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>I
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>think would be the better candidate to add to <catchWord> for such
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>cases.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>(current content model is: a
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>><cid:part1.05090306.09010306@emory.edu>
>>
>>
>>>>>>abbr <cid:part2.03060102.02060104@emory.edu> foreign
>>>>>><cid:part3.00090801.02000402@emory.edu> index
>>>>>><cid:part4.07070801.02040104@emory.edu> note
>>>>>><cid:part5.04030808.00080301@emory.edu> reference
>>>>>><cid:part6.04080806.02070003@emory.edu> seg
>>>>>><cid:part7.04010103.03090506@emory.edu> w
>>>>>><cid:part8.00050307.00090706@emory.edu>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Patrick
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>See the footnote of CEV 1Kgs.8.62.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Todd
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>>osis-core mailing list
>>>>>>>osis-core@bibletechnologieswg.org
>>>>>>>http://www.bibletechnologieswg.org/mailman/listinfo/osis-core
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>--
>>>>>>Patrick Durusau
>>>>>>Director of Research and Development
>>>>>>Society of Biblical Literature
>>>>>>Patrick.Durusau@sbl-site.org
>>>>>>Co-Editor, ISO 13250, Topic Maps -- Reference Model
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>osis-core mailing list
>>>>>osis-core@bibletechnologieswg.org
>>>>>http://www.bibletechnologieswg.org/mailman/listinfo/osis-core
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>--
>>>>Patrick Durusau
>>>>Director of Research and Development
>>>>Society of Biblical Literature
>>>>Patrick.Durusau@sbl-site.org
>>>>Co-Editor, ISO 13250, Topic Maps -- Reference Model
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>osis-core mailing list
>>>>osis-core@bibletechnologieswg.org
>>>>http://www.bibletechnologieswg.org/mailman/listinfo/osis-core
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>_______________________________________________
>>>osis-core mailing list
>>>osis-core@bibletechnologieswg.org
>>>http://www.bibletechnologieswg.org/mailman/listinfo/osis-core
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>--
>>Patrick Durusau
>>Director of Research and Development
>>Society of Biblical Literature
>>Patrick.Durusau@sbl-site.org
>>Co-Editor, ISO 13250, Topic Maps -- Reference Model
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>osis-core mailing list
>>osis-core@bibletechnologieswg.org
>>http://www.bibletechnologieswg.org/mailman/lis> tinfo/osis-core
>>
>>
>>
>
>_______________________________________________
>osis-core mailing list
>osis-core@bibletechnologieswg.org
>http://www.bibletechnologieswg.org/mailman/listinfo/osis-core
>
>
>
--
Patrick Durusau
Director of Research and Development
Society of Biblical Literature
Patrick.Durusau@sbl-site.org
Co-Editor, ISO 13250, Topic Maps -- Reference Model